Author Topic: Developing FF4kster: a comprehensive editor for FF4  (Read 223653 times)

Pinkpuff

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #765 on: March 26, 2014, 03:59:47 PM »
Also a syntax update... In the AI there's a command called "Cast Black or White Magic Spell" and "Cast a Special Spell". Now the first one tells the enemy to randomly single target an ally or enemy. The second one tells the game to Multi-Target. There doesn't seem to be much special about it. I can change that easily enough with the indexes, but its just something to keep in mind.

Ok cool, I just got those descriptions either from some file or from some post here. Is the wording the only issue there, or does any of the actual functionality need changing?

Ok so I found this in my to-do list and started investigating. It appears the "parameter" menu for "cast a black or white spell" only allows, well, black or white spells, and the "cast a special spell" allows any white spell, and any black spell up to Psych/Osmose. I suspect that second one was supposed to list monster spells or something and just had its index thrown off (never mind, upon further investigation there's a separate index for that). But what I'm wondering is, should it be the case that both of these, "cast a single-target spell" or "cast a group-target spell", be allowed to take any spell, player spell or monster technique alike? (again, upon further investigation there isn't enough room for those indexes...)

So just to verify, it seems that you can have a monster single-target any black or white spell, but only multi-target the ones in that range? That's bizzarre... but then again that's FF4 for ya...
« Last Edit: March 26, 2014, 04:13:17 PM by Pinkpuff »
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Grimoire LD

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #766 on: March 26, 2014, 10:20:09 PM »
Hmm? So you can't have an enemy multi-target Nuke or Meteo? But we know that Zeromus can multi-target Meteo, he uses it explicitly on the party.

JCE3000GT

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #767 on: March 26, 2014, 10:41:06 PM »
I thought I had Zeromus or XT multi-target Meteo on my FF2usHT mod..?  Though it has been over 10 years since I did that mod...  LOL!

Pinkpuff

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #768 on: March 27, 2014, 05:21:04 AM »
Hmm? So you can't have an enemy multi-target Nuke or Meteo? But we know that Zeromus can multi-target Meteo, he uses it explicitly on the party.

*Shrug* I haven't tried these out yet, I'm just going by what I've been told. But the "cast a special spell"/"cast group-targeting spell" only applies to the range 31-5E:

Quote from: eas.txt
=============================================================
Attack Byte Meanings (based on the Tower of Bab-il document)
=============================================================
00-30: Spell number
31-5E: Spell number + 30
5F-BF: Enemy spell/special attack number
C0-E7: Battle Command + C0. So C0 is Fight, C2 is magic, C6 is Jump, etc.
    E1 is a special "do nothing" command
...

So that means it can only apply to spells 01 to 2E.

As far as monsters using Meteo, it could simply be that the "single-target" effect is actualy "regular target", i.e. if it auto-targets group (e.g. Quake, Meteo) then it still will, but if it can target only a single unit then it will do that; whereas the "group-target" is "force group-target", so even spells that normally can only target a single unit will instead target the group. Again I haven't tested this I'm just throwing out hypotheses.
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chillyfeez

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #769 on: March 27, 2014, 07:31:03 AM »
Monster AI also has separate instructions that can be remarkably specific about who the monster is targeting. I think if you throw that in there ahead of any spell/monster skill, you can choose to target whomever you want. But I haven't tested extensively - I always just figured it would work.

Dragonsbrethren

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #770 on: March 31, 2014, 05:45:40 PM »
Hmm? So you can't have an enemy multi-target Nuke or Meteo? But we know that Zeromus can multi-target Meteo, he uses it explicitly on the party.
Don't multi-target Nuke, bad things happen:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsLNwmDAABc

IIRC, the same thing happens with White. Some sort of overflow and memory corruption. Not sure if it'd fair any better targeting players, but I doubt it. Figured that's why they made the (enemy skill) MegaNuke animation.

JCE3000GT

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #771 on: March 31, 2014, 06:02:27 PM »
I do remember playing around with both Nuke and the Crystal's white/blue palette version of it on multiple people but I vaguely remember the graphics glitching out and something else happening similar to your video.  Didn't remember anything about Meteo specifically. 

I cannot believe it has been so long since I even thought about this subject.  :)

P.S. I completely forgot about your video!  Wow, 2008, time flies! 

Grimoire LD

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #772 on: March 31, 2014, 09:37:12 PM »
...That was unexpected. To its credit the graphic Actually works, to my surprise, but I was not expecting that kind of result! Was that Dummy item acquiring also part of the weirdness that occurred with that?

Pinkpuff

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #773 on: April 04, 2014, 05:57:18 AM »
Just a quick minor update on what I'm doing right now and my plans with regards to this project:

The tile editor is on hold until I can the 4bpp tilesets working (Ship, Airship). I'm so close to being able to read the tiles dynamically I can taste it; but at the same time I just can't seem to get that final piece of the puzzle. If you are willing/able to help with that, the thread is here:
http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=1856.msg20710#msg20710

In the meantime I am tackling the to-do list that's been building up over the years. Relatively minor things (imo) but things that should definitely be included. I may have questions from time to time related to these as I go digging back through this thread and the other wishlist threads in an effort to find exactly what things were documented and what things are still an open question.

With regard to that my immediate plans are to tackle:
  • Solo battles (where one character, or all but one character, is hidden)
  • Misc command parameters (delay, cursor targeting, etc; if there are any other commands that have known parameters that haven't been posted, this would be a perfect time)
  • Adding the overworld(s) to the map editor
The complete list is much longer than this of course, but these are the major areas I'd like to tackle soon.
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chillyfeez

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #774 on: April 04, 2014, 07:01:09 AM »
A word of caution on world map editing - major changes have the potential to extend map data beyond feasible lengths, especially with respect to the Underworld and Moon. Yousei's editor would increase ROM size and relocate the data in such cases. You'll probably at least want to include an overflow safeguard.
Sorry if you knew that already.

Pinkpuff

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #775 on: April 04, 2014, 11:11:06 AM »
Thanks for the warning!

Rom expansion is pretty much out of the question, and relocating data would be a pain (though I would consider looking into it if it's unreasonably cramped for space), but an overflow safeguard will defiinitely be put in. Actually one of the items on my to-do list is to go back and retroactively put in overflow safeguards on pretty much everything.
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koala_knight

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #776 on: April 04, 2014, 01:33:48 PM »
No rom expansion? That begs the question, after using your editor would I be able to use Yousei's for map stuff and rom expansion?

chillyfeez

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #777 on: April 04, 2014, 02:06:28 PM »
Decidedly not, koala_knight. Yousei's uses v1.0 exclusively, and FF4kster is only fully compatible with v1.1

koala_knight

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #778 on: April 05, 2014, 07:06:06 PM »
Then the next logical question is whether there is source code for Yousei's editor and how extensive the differences are between the 1.0 and 1.1 roms.

Grimoire LD

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Re: Developing a comprehensive editor for FF4
« Reply #779 on: April 06, 2014, 05:29:49 PM »
Just a quick minor update on what I'm doing right now and my plans with regards to this project:

The tile editor is on hold until I can the 4bpp tilesets working (Ship, Airship). I'm so close to being able to read the tiles dynamically I can taste it; but at the same time I just can't seem to get that final piece of the puzzle. If you are willing/able to help with that, the thread is here:
http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=1856.msg20710#msg20710

In the meantime I am tackling the to-do list that's been building up over the years. Relatively minor things (imo) but things that should definitely be included. I may have questions from time to time related to these as I go digging back through this thread and the other wishlist threads in an effort to find exactly what things were documented and what things are still an open question.

With regard to that my immediate plans are to tackle:
  • Solo battles (where one character, or all but one character, is hidden)
  • Misc command parameters (delay, cursor targeting, etc; if there are any other commands that have known parameters that haven't been posted, this would be a perfect time)
  • Adding the overworld(s) to the map editor
The complete list is much longer than this of course, but these are the major areas I'd like to tackle soon.

That sounds great! If you need any assistance locating or expounding upon meanings in those locations, please let me know. Some of the targeting for the commands isn't really "there'. A lot of it is set from the individual routines.  And only the ones which I have mentioned before are the exception. Basically, anything that casts a spell can have its target changed. Everything else mostly uses the Fight/Kick Routine.